diff --git a/CodeWalker.Core/GameFiles/FileTypes/YmapFile.cs b/CodeWalker.Core/GameFiles/FileTypes/YmapFile.cs
index d59c238..81955e3 100644
--- a/CodeWalker.Core/GameFiles/FileTypes/YmapFile.cs
+++ b/CodeWalker.Core/GameFiles/FileTypes/YmapFile.cs
@@ -1776,6 +1776,31 @@ namespace CodeWalker.GameFiles
             UpdateEntityHash();
         }
 
+        public YmapEntityDef(YmapEntityDef mloParent, MCEntityDef ent, int index)
+        {
+            Ymap = null;
+            Index = index;
+            CEntityDef = ent._Data;
+            Scale = new Vector3(new Vector2(_CEntityDef.scaleXY), _CEntityDef.scaleZ);
+            MloRefPosition = _CEntityDef.position;
+            MloRefOrientation = new Quaternion(_CEntityDef.rotation);
+            if (MloRefOrientation != Quaternion.Identity)
+            {
+                MloRefOrientation = Quaternion.Invert(MloRefOrientation);
+            }
+            IsMlo = false;
+
+            Extensions = ent.Extensions;
+            MloParent = mloParent;
+            Position = mloParent.Position + mloParent.Orientation.Multiply(MloRefPosition);
+            Orientation = Quaternion.Multiply(mloParent.Orientation, MloRefOrientation);
+            
+            UpdateWidgetPosition();
+            UpdateWidgetOrientation();
+            UpdateEntityHash();
+        }
+
+
 
         public void SetArchetype(Archetype arch)
         {
@@ -1859,6 +1884,36 @@ namespace CodeWalker.GameFiles
             UpdateWidgetPosition();
         }
 
+        public void SetPositionRaw(Vector3 pos)
+        {
+            //set the raw position value in the CEntityDef, and update everything from that.
+            //used by the EditYmapEntityPanel
+
+            _CEntityDef.position = pos;
+
+            if (MloParent != null)
+            {
+                MloRefPosition = pos;
+                Position = MloParent.Position + MloParent.Orientation.Multiply(MloRefPosition);
+                UpdateBB();
+                UpdateMloArchetype();
+            }
+            else
+            {
+                Position = pos;
+                UpdateBB();
+            }
+
+            if (MloInstance != null)
+            {
+                MloInstance.SetPosition(Position);
+                MloInstance.UpdateEntities();
+            }
+
+            UpdateEntityHash();
+            UpdateWidgetPosition();
+        }
+
         private void UpdateBB()
         {
             if (Archetype != null)
@@ -1945,6 +2000,45 @@ namespace CodeWalker.GameFiles
             UpdateWidgetOrientation();
         }
 
+        public void SetOrientationRaw(Quaternion ori)
+        {
+            //set the raw rotation value in the CEntityDef, and update everything from that.
+            //used by the EditYmapEntityPanel
+
+            _CEntityDef.rotation = ori.ToVector4();
+
+            if (MloParent != null)
+            {
+                MloRefOrientation = ori;
+                if (MloRefOrientation != Quaternion.Identity)
+                {
+                    MloRefOrientation = Quaternion.Invert(MloRefOrientation);
+                }
+                Orientation = Quaternion.Multiply(MloParent.Orientation, MloRefOrientation);
+            }
+            else
+            {
+                Orientation = ori;
+                if (MloInstance == null)//CMloInstanceDef quaternions aren't inverted, but CEntityDef ones are
+                {
+                    if (Orientation != Quaternion.Identity)
+                    {
+                        Orientation = Quaternion.Invert(Orientation);
+                    }
+                }
+            }
+
+            if (MloInstance != null)
+            {
+                MloInstance.SetOrientation(Orientation);
+                MloInstance.UpdateEntities();
+            }
+
+            UpdateBB();
+            UpdateWidgetPosition();
+            UpdateWidgetOrientation();
+        }
+
         public void SetScale(Vector3 s)
         {
             Scale = new Vector3(s.X, s.X, s.Z);
diff --git a/CodeWalker.Core/GameFiles/MetaTypes/Archetype.cs b/CodeWalker.Core/GameFiles/MetaTypes/Archetype.cs
index 41a1e27..8692d43 100644
--- a/CodeWalker.Core/GameFiles/MetaTypes/Archetype.cs
+++ b/CodeWalker.Core/GameFiles/MetaTypes/Archetype.cs
@@ -620,7 +620,7 @@ namespace CodeWalker.GameFiles
             var entlist = new List<YmapEntityDef>();
             for (int i = 0; i < ec; i++)
             {
-                var e = CreateYmapEntity(Owner, MloArch.entities[i], i);
+                var e = new YmapEntityDef(Owner, MloArch.entities[i], i);
                 entlist.Add(e);
             }
 
@@ -638,7 +638,7 @@ namespace CodeWalker.GameFiles
                     {
                         for (int j = 0; j < entitySet.Entities.Length; j++)
                         {
-                            var e = CreateYmapEntity(Owner, entitySet.Entities[j], lasti);
+                            var e = new YmapEntityDef(Owner, entitySet.Entities[j], lasti);
                             instset.Entities.Add(e);
                             e.MloEntitySet = instset;
                             lasti++;
@@ -762,21 +762,6 @@ namespace CodeWalker.GameFiles
             }
         }
 
-        public YmapEntityDef CreateYmapEntity(YmapEntityDef owner, MCEntityDef ment, int index)
-        {
-            YmapEntityDef e = new YmapEntityDef(null, index, ref ment._Data);
-            e.Extensions = ment.Extensions;
-            e.MloRefPosition = e.Position;
-            e.MloRefOrientation = e.Orientation;
-            e.MloParent = owner;
-            e.Position = owner.Position + owner.Orientation.Multiply(e.MloRefPosition);
-            e.Orientation = Quaternion.Multiply(owner.Orientation, e.MloRefOrientation);
-            e.UpdateWidgetPosition();
-            e.UpdateWidgetOrientation();
-            e.UpdateEntityHash();
-            return e;
-        }
-
         public MCEntityDef TryGetArchetypeEntity(YmapEntityDef ymapEntity)
         {
             if (ymapEntity == null) return null;
diff --git a/CodeWalker/Project/Panels/EditYmapEntityPanel.cs b/CodeWalker/Project/Panels/EditYmapEntityPanel.cs
index fa09a43..f8738f5 100644
--- a/CodeWalker/Project/Panels/EditYmapEntityPanel.cs
+++ b/CodeWalker/Project/Panels/EditYmapEntityPanel.cs
@@ -381,26 +381,17 @@ namespace CodeWalker.Project.Panels
             Vector3 v = FloatUtil.ParseVector3String(EntityPositionTextBox.Text);
             lock (ProjectForm.ProjectSyncRoot)
             {
-                if (CurrentEntity.MloParent != null)
+                if (CurrentEntity._CEntityDef.position != v)
                 {
-                    v = CurrentEntity.MloParent.Position + CurrentEntity.MloParent.Orientation.Multiply(v);
-                    CurrentEntity.SetPosition(v);
+                    CurrentEntity.SetPositionRaw(v);
                     ProjectItemChanged();
-                }
-                else
-                {
-                    if (CurrentEntity.Position != v)
+                    var wf = ProjectForm.WorldForm;
+                    if (wf != null)
                     {
-                        CurrentEntity.SetPosition(v);
-                        ProjectItemChanged();
-                        var wf = ProjectForm.WorldForm;
-                        if (wf != null)
+                        wf.BeginInvoke(new Action(() =>
                         {
-                            wf.BeginInvoke(new Action(() =>
-                            {
-                                wf.SetWidgetPosition(CurrentEntity.WidgetPosition, true);
-                            }));
-                        }
+                            wf.SetWidgetPosition(CurrentEntity.WidgetPosition, true);
+                        }));
                     }
                 }
             }
@@ -416,20 +407,9 @@ namespace CodeWalker.Project.Panels
             {
                 if (CurrentEntity._CEntityDef.rotation != v)
                 {
-                    var wf = ProjectForm.WorldForm;
-
-                    if (CurrentEntity.MloParent != null)
-                    {
-                        var world = Quaternion.Normalize(Quaternion.Multiply(q, CurrentEntity.MloParent.Orientation));
-                        CurrentEntity.SetOrientation(world);
-                    }
-                    else
-                    {
-                        bool useInverse = (CurrentEntity.MloInstance == null);
-                        CurrentEntity.SetOrientation(q, useInverse);
-                    }
-
+                    CurrentEntity.SetOrientationRaw(q);
                     ProjectItemChanged();
+                    var wf = ProjectForm.WorldForm;
                     wf?.BeginInvoke(new Action(() =>
                     {
                         wf.SetWidgetRotation(CurrentEntity.WidgetOrientation, true);
diff --git a/CodeWalker/Project/ProjectForm.cs b/CodeWalker/Project/ProjectForm.cs
index 45c60e3..367ff83 100644
--- a/CodeWalker/Project/ProjectForm.cs
+++ b/CodeWalker/Project/ProjectForm.cs
@@ -3588,7 +3588,7 @@ namespace CodeWalker.Project
 
             var createindex = mloArch.entities.Length;
             var ment = new MCEntityDef(ref cent, mloArch);
-            var outEnt = mloInstance.CreateYmapEntity(mloInstance.Owner, ment, createindex);
+            var outEnt = new YmapEntityDef(mloInstance.Owner, ment, createindex);
 
             try
             {